FOR THOSE ACTUALLY INTERESTED IN POLITICS

Thanks Bernie Bots and Stein supporters.

nan said:

 I fight the DNC, because I hold them responsible for getting the psycho orange reality star elected. I don't subscribe  to the Russiagate  or blame it on Jill Stein or others with no money or power theories.  

See, this is where we differ.  Sure, the DNC screwed the pooch and left us to deal with the half man half dog offspring but I am also outraged by Russian meddling.

A foreign power interfered in our election.  How does that not piss you off?

sbenois said:
Thanks Bernie Bots and Stein supporters.

 You have no one to blame but yourself (and the Russians).

According to YOU.   Thanks for your opinion.

Klinker said:

nan said:

 I fight the DNC, because I hold them responsible for getting the psycho orange reality star elected. I don't subscribe  to the Russiagate  or blame it on Jill Stein or others with no money or power theories.  

See, this is where we differ.  Sure, the DNC screwed the pooch and left us to deal with the half man half dog offspring but I am also outraged by Russian meddling.
A foreign power interfered in our election.  How does that not piss you off?

 Cause it's not proven, despite what you hear on MSM said as fact.  Also, I agree with Noam Chomsky:

Wow, Noam is left out A LOT!  And the normal reply - US is just as bad - so we should basically accept and expect Russian interference - ALL GOOD!  And he says MAYBE Russia did something.  But it's mostly the MSM fault because they hate Trump.

And nan and friends DO NOT want the fake Mueller probe to go on.  Neither does Trump or Sputnik News (Whoever owns that).

nan said:

Klinker said:

nan said:

 I fight the DNC, because I hold them responsible for getting the psycho orange reality star elected. I don't subscribe  to the Russiagate  or blame it on Jill Stein or others with no money or power theories.  

See, this is where we differ.  Sure, the DNC screwed the pooch and left us to deal with the half man half dog offspring but I am also outraged by Russian meddling.
A foreign power interfered in our election.  How does that not piss you off?

 Cause it's not proven, despite what you hear on MSM said as fact.  Also, I agree with Noam Chomsky

 Well. So much for sbenois' mythical monolithical Bernie Bot Boogie Man.

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on that.

sbenois said:
According to YOU.   Thanks for your opinion.

 See, all you have to do is admit that you and your fellow Clintoncrats screwed up but you just can't do it because you are so filled with toxic hubris.  

You know in your heart of hearts that I'm right and I bet that just burns you up.

Couldn't give a **** what you think. 

sbenois said:
Couldn't give a **** what you think. 

 Yeah, but its not about what I think.  Its about what you think but you just can't admit.

Um, please stop projecting.  Thanks.

This “discussion” is pathetic.

 so's your old man.

Klinker said:
Those who do not learn (from) history are doomed to repeat it

 Those most doomed to repeat it are the people who "learn" the wrong history.

Like you, Nan and the other Hillary/DNC conspiracists.

Another example of “Dems eat their own”.

It really doesn’t matter what happened in the past, other than how we learn from it. I understand that you disagree on how we learn, but the constant returns to two years ago are getting old and counterproductive.

Everyone here is right!

Clinton screwed up. Bernie was unelectable outside the Northeast and California. Clinton ignored the white working class. Voting for Stein was a mistake. The progressives have some great ideas. War is bad and getting the people to understand that we do not have to invest so much is the military is key! Black lives Matter!  Patriotism isn’t wrong. God forbid, but maybe we need to look at tariff levels across nations and see if they make sense. Maybe we do more than our fair share for the U.N.

We do need to invest more in infrastructure. Et cetera, et cetera.

Please just stop.

This thread was intended to return the discussion to politics, not infighting.

I applaud Lost for starting it.

.

What do Tulsi Gabbard’s fans think of last year’s New Yorker profile? This letter to the editor highlights some of its more provocative details:

As Representative Tulsi Gabbard’s aunt, it gives me no pleasure to publicly air my doubts regarding my niece’s political agenda, which Kelefa Sanneh describes in his Profile (“Against the Tide,” November 6th). However, I take my role as a citizen seriously, and I would be remiss not to share my concerns. Sanneh raises the issue of Gabbard’s lifelong immersion in the Science of Identity Foundation, an opaque religious organization that she and its founder, Chris Butler, have attempted to reframe as a “resource.” Gabbard’s answer to a basic question about Butler is troubling: despite calling him her “guru dev” (spiritual master) in her own promotional video, she denies that he is more important than any of her other teachers. She also has a notably mixed voting record, and associations that veer from certain progressive causes to the apparent courting of such strongmen as Narendra Modi, Bashar al-Assad, and Abdel Fattah el-Sisi (not to mention Trump)—this zigzagging path through positions is vexing. Sanneh’s article walks the fine line of investigation and exposition in a way that points to shadows worthy of further illumination.

Caroline Sinavaiana Gabbard

Honolulu, Hawaii

jimmurphy said:

drummerboy said:

 so's your old man.

 Eff you. Uncalled for.

 dude.

twas a joke.

sorry it didn't come off.

DaveSchmidt said:
What do Tulsi Gabbard’s fans think of last year’s New Yorker profile? This letter to the editor highlights some of its more provocative details:

As Representative Tulsi Gabbard’s aunt, it gives me no pleasure to publicly air my doubts regarding my niece’s political agenda, which Kelefa Sanneh describes in his Profile (“Against the Tide,” November 6th). However, I take my role as a citizen seriously, and I would be remiss not to share my concerns. Sanneh raises the issue of Gabbard’s lifelong immersion in the Science of Identity Foundation, an opaque religious organization that she and its founder, Chris Butler, have attempted to reframe as a “resource.” Gabbard’s answer to a basic question about Butler is troubling: despite calling him her “guru dev” (spiritual master) in her own promotional video, she denies that he is more important than any of her other teachers. She also has a notably mixed voting record, and associations that veer from certain progressive causes to the apparent courting of such strongmen as Narendra Modi, Bashar al-Assad, and Abdel Fattah el-Sisi (not to mention Trump)—this zigzagging path through positions is vexing. Sanneh’s article walks the fine line of investigation and exposition in a way that points to shadows worthy of further illumination.

Caroline Sinavaiana Gabbard

Honolulu, Hawaii

Looks like Tulsi is going to need a more expensive PR firm.

in an amusing aside to what's going on in US politics, over in Australia we're about to see our Prime Minister forced to face a party-room spill i.e. a challenge for leadership which means he'll also lose the PM's job. 

The person touted as next PM, Peter Dutton, was just this afternoon exposed as probably being ineligible for sitting in Parliament under new financial rules pertaining to child care centres - his wife owns and runs a string of them. 

Dutton is our current Minister for Immigration and Home affairs or Homeland or whatever he calls the wretched inflated Department (inspired by the fascist governments of the 30s-50s). He's also extremely right-wing, and favours light-complexioned, blond citizens. He wants us back in the 1950s. *shudder*

drummerboy said:

 dude.
twas a joke.
sorry it didn't come off.

 epithet withdrawn.

jamie said:
Wow, Noam is left out A LOT!  And the normal reply - US is just as bad - so we should basically accept and expect Russian interference - ALL GOOD!  And he says MAYBE Russia did something.  But it's mostly the MSM fault because they hate Trump.
And nan and friends DO NOT want the fake Mueller probe to go on.  Neither does Trump or Sputnik News (Whoever owns that).

 Why do you keep saying things that are not true?  No one you mentioned has said the Muller investigation should be stopped--well maybe Trump, did, not sure.  Let him investigate all he wants.  Perhaps he will find some criminal activity, as with Trump there is probably lots to be found.  Also, no one has ever said  said that Russia did not do anything, as countries try to spy and meddle on each other all the time, especially ours. We said that so far, there is no real evidence and indictments are not evidence.  I don't like the way unproven theories are stated as facts.  I do think the MSM has turned this into an obsessive new McCarthyism, and distorted all things Russia to evil beyond reality.  And that started with the Democrats trying to cover for their stunning loss, and those that want to vilify Russia for possible regime change (like Dave's friend, Gary Kasparov). I've said this over and over and you just keep trying to smear me and others.  Why is that?

drummerboy said:

Klinker said:
Those who do not learn (from) history are doomed to repeat it

 Those most doomed to repeat it are the people who "learn" the wrong history.
Like you, Nan and the other Hillary/DNC conspiracists.

 What history did I learn wrong?  

DaveSchmidt said:
What do Tulsi Gabbard’s fans think of last year’s New Yorker profile? This letter to the editor highlights some of its more provocative details:

As Representative Tulsi Gabbard’s aunt, it gives me no pleasure to publicly air my doubts regarding my niece’s political agenda, which Kelefa Sanneh describes in his Profile (“Against the Tide,” November 6th). However, I take my role as a citizen seriously, and I would be remiss not to share my concerns. Sanneh raises the issue of Gabbard’s lifelong immersion in the Science of Identity Foundation, an opaque religious organization that she and its founder, Chris Butler, have attempted to reframe as a “resource.” Gabbard’s answer to a basic question about Butler is troubling: despite calling him her “guru dev” (spiritual master) in her own promotional video, she denies that he is more important than any of her other teachers. She also has a notably mixed voting record, and associations that veer from certain progressive causes to the apparent courting of such strongmen as Narendra Modi, Bashar al-Assad, and Abdel Fattah el-Sisi (not to mention Trump)—this zigzagging path through positions is vexing. Sanneh’s article walks the fine line of investigation and exposition in a way that points to shadows worthy of further illumination.

Caroline Sinavaiana Gabbard

Honolulu, Hawaii

 Thought it was good they paid attention to her. I remember I thought it was kind of a subtle hit piece.  The New Yorker is not as it once was, with intense fact checkers and a better attempt at objective reporting.  The recent Bill Browder piece I posted in another thread, really made me aware of how much they have gone downhill.  In that one, the neocon author made some mile negative remarks about the subject, ignoring facts about his criminality, to appear balanced, just so he could vilify Putin. 

dave said:

DaveSchmidt said:
What do Tulsi Gabbard’s fans think of last year’s New Yorker profile? This letter to the editor highlights some of its more provocative details:

As Representative Tulsi Gabbard’s aunt, it gives me no pleasure to publicly air my doubts regarding my niece’s political agenda, which Kelefa Sanneh describes in his Profile (“Against the Tide,” November 6th). However, I take my role as a citizen seriously, and I would be remiss not to share my concerns. Sanneh raises the issue of Gabbard’s lifelong immersion in the Science of Identity Foundation, an opaque religious organization that she and its founder, Chris Butler, have attempted to reframe as a “resource.” Gabbard’s answer to a basic question about Butler is troubling: despite calling him her “guru dev” (spiritual master) in her own promotional video, she denies that he is more important than any of her other teachers. She also has a notably mixed voting record, and associations that veer from certain progressive causes to the apparent courting of such strongmen as Narendra Modi, Bashar al-Assad, and Abdel Fattah el-Sisi (not to mention Trump)—this zigzagging path through positions is vexing. Sanneh’s article walks the fine line of investigation and exposition in a way that points to shadows worthy of further illumination.

Caroline Sinavaiana Gabbard

Honolulu, Hawaii

Looks like Tulsi is going to need a more expensive PR firm.

 Looks like the New Yorker is part of the MSM that smears Progressives.  This will happen in the next election unless she starts taking campaign contributions from the the oligarchs and falling in line.  That's why I always say to get your news from more than one source. 

You are as bad as the Trump people.  Anything written in the MSM is automatically discarded as fake or a smear.   Anything written by anyone else - here or in Moscow - is to be believed.

jimmurphy said:
Another example of “Dems eat their own”.


It really doesn’t matter what happened in the past, other than how we learn from it. I understand that you disagree on how we learn, but the constant returns to two years ago are getting old and counterproductive.


Everyone here is right!


Clinton screwed up. Bernie was unelectable outside the Northeast and California. Clinton ignored the white working class. Voting for Stein was a mistake. The progressives have some great ideas. War is bad and getting the people to understand that we do not have to invest so much is the military is key! Black lives Matter!  Patriotism isn’t wrong. God forbid, but maybe we need to look at tariff levels across nations and see if they make sense. Maybe we do more than our fair share for the U.N.
We do need to invest more in infrastructure. Et cetera, et cetera.


Please just stop.


This thread was intended to return the discussion to politics, not infighting.


I applaud Lost for starting it.

 Thank you. And your post is spot on!

yahooyahoo said:

 Okay, serious question.  What are some of the positive things that Pelosi has done as ranking Dem in the House since Trump came into office that someone else could not have done?

 First, let's get our terms correct. Nancy Pelosi is the Minority Leader. When the Dems held the majority she was the Speaker of the House and I believe Hoyer was the Majority Leader and effectively second in command.

Now to answer the question. She has kept the Dems united. I do not believe that even one has defected to Trump. If you think that is not a great achievement you do not understand the Democratic Party or the power of the President, or even the nature of Congress.

As to the posts about learning from history, history is not just the last 10 years. I am currently reading "Playing With Fire" O'Donnell's book about the 1968 election. Even though I lived through it and participated first hand I am learning things I did not know. I would recommend it to Nan and others. There are many good books on politics and history. One favorite is "What It Takes". I humbly suggest you take a break from pod casts and read a couple of books.

BTW "Playing With Fire" has great insight into the making of today's Republican and Democratic Parties.

sbenois said:
You are as bad as the Trump people.  Anything written in the MSM is automatically discarded as fake or a smear.   Anything written by anyone else - here or in Moscow - is to be believed.

 No, I was reading the New Yorker this morning, in fact and enjoying some of their comments on censorship.  I have never said to stop reading/watching MSM.  What I say over and over is that you should always be a skeptic and not get your news from one source.