# release the documents
Paul: I have read reports that the DOJ and FBI called for redactions after the Republican memo had reached the White House. Yet the president authorized its release without them.
When I noted that, you drew a distinction, saying the request on the GOP memo concerned only the names of DOJ and FBI officials, whereas the request on the Dem memo concerns methods and sources.
That is indeed a distinction if true — and if it applies in both cases to requests made to the White House — but I haven’t seen that reported. That’s why I asked if you could point me to your source for that detail.
DaveSchmidt said:
Paul: I have read reports that the DOJ and FBI called for redactions after the Republican memo had reached the White House. Yet the president authorized its release without them.
When I noted that, you drew a distinction, saying the request on the GOP memo concerned only the names of DOJ and FBI officials, whereas the request on the Dem memo concerns methods and sources.
That is indeed a distinction if true — and if it applies in both cases to requests made to the White House — but I haven’t seen that reported. That’s why I asked if you could point me to your source for that detail.
Here's what I'm saying:
DOJ / FBI statements on Republican memo:
Before it was sent to WH -- call for redaction of sources and methods. Done, sent to WH.
After it was sent to WH -- call for memo to be blocked because of "grave concerns about omissions and accuracy"
Sources:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/31/us/politics/fbi-director-republicans-secret-memo.html
https://twitter.com/search?l=&q=source%20methods%20from%3Abyronyork&src=typd&lang=en
paulsurovell said:
During the hysterical phase of the "stop the memo" campaign, ...
Hold it right there. It was "#releasethememo" that was hysterical. It was going to expose "worse than Watergate" behavior, remember? The Democrats said the GOP-alone version was misleading. Instead of working on a less misleading version, the GOP said, "Do your own memo."
And what happens? GOP-only version is released, the "#releasethememo" crowd accepts it as accurate, and only after do other details start to come out that show that it's deceptive.
So because of the hysterical support, the one misleading memo is the only one out there for the foreseeable future. IF the correcting memo from the Democrats does ever get out, it's some time after the deceptive one.
paulsurovell said:
You didn't mention why there's a delay --
I didn't mention the reasons given because it wasn't relevant to my point. You ignored that, of course. Here it is again, please note the highlighting in particular.
South_Mountaineer said:
So to nobody's surprise, the memo correcting the incomplete GOP narrative will be delayed. Also to nobody's surprise, there are those who are fine with that.
Post edited to add - For "context" I should note that the quoted.text below is from January 30.
South_Mountaineer said:
So you're okay with this procedure? The memo described as misleading (by people who saw the underlying documents) will go out to the public, and the "more context" one sits in the "out box" for an undetermined time. If and when the GOP majority decides it could go out, then it goes to Trump who has the final say. I doubt Hannity will be shouting and hashtagging for that context memo.
As the old saying goes, "A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to put its pants on." Here it's even worse, and you're supporting the guys who will probably try to hide the pants.
paulsurovell said:
Here's a more accurate report on the committee's vote on the Democratic memo. There was a unanimous vote to allow the Democratic memo follow the same process as the Republican memo:
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/memo-war-gop-to-release-memo-aimed-at-justice-department-dems-push-memo-aimed-at-gop/article/2647479?platform=hootsuite
But there was also a rare moment of bipartisanship for the bitterly divided panel. At the same meeting, Republicans and Democrats voted unanimously to make the Democratic memo — the counter-memo to the Republican document — available to all members of the House.
That is the same process Republicans, under chairman Devin Nunes, R-Calif., followed with their memo. First, make it available to House members. (That happened on Jan. 18.) Later, after members of both parties have had a chance to read the memo, decide whether to release it to the public.
Post edited to add - and spotted at the supermarket, a good summary of the narrative the GOP has successfully embedded in the minds of much of the public:
jamie said:
Democratic memo released: https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/24/politics/democratic-memo-house-intelligence-released/index.html
Good coverage here: https://twitter.com/emptywheel?lang=en
South_Mountaineer said:
Post edited to add - and spotted at the supermarket, a good summary of the narrative the GOP has successfully embedded in the minds of much of the public:
I think the tabloid you saw at the supermarket is the National Enquirer. The owner, David Pecker, is a very close and good friend of Trump.
The White House must have been working around the clock on the declassification process to get the Schiff memo released on a Saturday afternoon a couple of weeks after the Nunes memo went public.
I think part of the delay was so that the R's could get their anti-Schiff-Memo talking points all lined up and ready to go the moment the memo was released.
Stoughton said:
The White House must have been working around the clock on the declassification process to get the Schiff memo released on a Saturday afternoon a couple of weeks after the Nunes memo went public.
It was released on the same day that Nunes was accepting an award at the CPAC conference of the American Conservative Union's Defender of Freedom Award, conferred on him because of his "lonely pursuit of truth on behalf of the American people."
drummerboy said:
I think part of the delay was so that the R's could get their anti-Schiff-Memo talking points all lined up and ready to go the moment the memo was released.
Yes. The GOP counter-memo to the Schiff counter-memo to the Nunes memo.
cramer said:
Stoughton said:
The White House must have been working around the clock on the declassification process to get the Schiff memo released on a Saturday afternoon a couple of weeks after the Nunes memo went public.
It was released on the same day that Nunes was accepting an award at the CPAC conference of the American Conservative Union's Defender of Freedom Award, conferred on him because of his "lonely pursuit of truth on behalf of the American people."
"Defender of Freedom Award"
Well deserved, but what exactly does that mean to the average American. Defending Freedom to the average Conservative vs the average Liberal, is as different as day and night. IMHO, the Mel Gibson , Brave Heart kind of Freedom is what I'm talking about.; freedom from excessive government restraints, as to what I see the left's as, the freedom from consequence, and individual responsibility. Just say'n...
ajc said:
cramer said:
Stoughton said:
The White House must have been working around the clock on the declassification process to get the Schiff memo released on a Saturday afternoon a couple of weeks after the Nunes memo went public.
It was released on the same day that Nunes was accepting an award at the CPAC conference of the American Conservative Union's Defender of Freedom Award, conferred on him because of his "lonely pursuit of truth on behalf of the American people."
"Defender of Freedom Award"
Well deserved, but what exactly does that mean to the average American. Defending Freedom to the average Conservative vs the average Liberal, is as different as day and night. IMHO, the Mel Gibson , Brave Heart kind of Freedom is what I'm talking about.; freedom from excessive government restraints, as to what I see the left's as, the freedom from consequence, and individual responsibility. Just say'n...
Ironically, the Mel Gibson Brave Heart kind of Freedom is to overthrow the feudal King of a different country in order to pledge serfdom to a feudal King from your own country. It's the freedom to be taxed by one of your own tyrants, rather than the tyrant of an invader.
Sorry, but I disagree, it wasn't an either or, one ruler over another. It's all about individual freedom. I see it more like it's the weaker among us, (the left) who have less interest in freedom from government; and prefer to have government control us, whether others need it or not...
Except of course when you and the rest of the MORONS on the right want to dictate to a woman what she should be doing with her womb. You are such a ******* hypocrite Arturo.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/private-prisons-here-s-why-sessions-memo-matters-n725316
As part of President Trump's pro-freedom agenda, Jeff Sessions wants to imprison hundreds of thousands more people and force taxpayers to fund the for-profit companies that are running those facilities.
Stoughton said:
The White House must have been working around the clock on the declassification process to get the Schiff memo released on a Saturday afternoon a couple of weeks after the Nunes memo went public.
The Dem memo was highly redacted by the FBI. This is what Schiff said on Tuesday:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/21/politics/adam-schiff-memo-release/index.html
California Rep. Adam Schiff said Tuesday that his negotiations with the FBI over redacting portions of the Democratic memo were almost concluded. "I actually hope that we'll do that in the next few days. It's my goal to have this out this week," Schiff said at an event hosted by the Commonwealth Club in San Francisco on Tuesday evening.
ajc said:
Sorry, but I disagree, it wasn't an either or, one ruler over another. It's all about individual freedom. I see it more like it's the weaker among us, (the left) who have less interest in freedom from government; and prefer to have government control us, whether others need it or not...
Then you need a better analogy than William Wallace, because all Scotland did was to defeat a foreign king and replace him with a local king. Conservatives are not really about individual freedom at all. They're taking our money and building a wall with it. Nothing says individual freedom like a massive wall. Conservatives also love to regulate sexual education in schools; the conservative attorney general wants to supercede the will of voters in states where they have chosen to legalize marijuana sales and use, even for medical purposes; they are regulating the **** out of abortion clinics; they wrote the USA PATRIOT Act, ffs. The right don't give a **** about your individual freedom, ajc.
sbenois said:
Except of course when you and the rest of the MORONS on the right want to dictate to a woman what she should be doing with her womb. You are such a ******* hypocrite Arturo.
Sbenois, It's all about "Individual freedom", and IMHO, with certain exceptions, that does not include the slaughter of the unborn capable of living outside the womb. (I'll be happy to debate you on the issues)
As I said, I see it more like it's the weaker among us, (the left) who are typically the ones who have less interest in freedom from government; and sometimes for better or worse, prefer to have government control us, whether others need it or not...
BTW pal, you and your ilk are getting ever and ever closer to crossing the line with your increasingly fowl and insulting personal remarks. If you guys can't control yourselves, and keep the comments to the issues, then maybe the next time we meet, instead of shaking hands, you may find mine up the side of your head... 
If the left is so "weak" how come the right runs around scared out of their panties that we're gonna take their guns? And if they're so strong, why do they have such an obsession with guns in the first place?
Remember when you were wetting your pants that ISIS was gonna come over and beat the crap out of us? Good times in profiles in courage.
Ooooh, MS13!!! Scary!
Why are you afraid of immigrants so much?
You wouldn't know courage if it bopped you upside the head.
ajc said:
sbenois said:
Except of course when you and the rest of the MORONS on the right want to dictate to a woman what she should be doing with her womb. You are such a ******* hypocrite Arturo.
Sbenois, It's all about "Individual freedom", and IMHO, with certain exceptions, that does not include the slaughter of the unborn capable of living outside the womb. (I'll be happy to debate you on the issues)
As I said, I see it more like it's the weaker among us, (the left) who are typically the ones who have less interest in freedom from government; and sometimes for better or worse, prefer to have government control us, whether others need it or not...
BTW pal, you and your ilk are getting ever and ever closer to crossing the line with your increasingly fowl and insulting personal remarks. If you guys can't control yourselves, and keep the comments to the issues, then maybe the next time we meet, instead of shaking hands, you may find mine up the side of your head...
ridski said:
ajc said:
Sorry, but I disagree, it wasn't an either or, one ruler over another. It's all about individual freedom. I see it more like it's the weaker among us, (the left) who have less interest in freedom from government; and prefer to have government control us, whether others need it or not...
Then you need a better analogy than William Wallace, because all Scotland did was to defeat a foreign king and replace him with a local king. Conservatives are not really about individual freedom at all. They're taking our money and building a wall with it. Nothing says individual freedom like a massive wall. Conservatives also love to regulate sexual education in schools; the conservative attorney general wants to supercede the will of voters in states where they have chosen to legalize marijuana sales and use, even for medical purposes; they are regulating the **** out of abortion clinics; they wrote the USA PATRIOT Act, ffs. The right don't give a **** about your individual freedom, ajc.
"The right don't give a **** about your individual freedom, Ajc."
I don't blindly go down any road Ridski... I'm my own person; and I don't fit perfectly in any box, right or left. The problem here is it's too easy to categorize one person with "everything", that one side or another says, or does. I'm as guilty as the next guy, so let's all try to agree not to agree, and stop always making it so personal, with all the childish name calling. Just say'n...
ajc said:
sbenois said:
Except of course when you and the rest of the MORONS on the right want to dictate to a woman what she should be doing with her womb. You are such a ******* hypocrite Arturo.
Sbenois, It's all about "Individual freedom", and IMHO, with certain exceptions, that does not include the slaughter of the unborn capable of living outside the womb. (I'll be happy to debate you on the issues)
As I said, I see it more like it's the weaker among us, (the left) who are typically the ones who have less interest in freedom from government; and sometimes for better or worse, prefer to have government control us, whether others need it or not...
BTW pal, you and your ilk are getting ever and ever closer to crossing the line with your increasingly fowl and insulting personal remarks. If you guys can't control yourselves, and keep the comments to the issues, then maybe the next time we meet, instead of shaking hands, you may find mine up the side of your head...
There he goes again, folks. Except when you accept the challenge, you find yourself in Ricalton square with nary an AJC in sight. Who would thunk that big brave AJC runs from a fight he himself provoked. So sad.
How ever one defines "Freedom" Devin Nunes is no champion of it. He's just a partisan hack at best and a Trump lap dog at worst.
Never saw "Brave Heart". I know Gibson is an anti-Semite. I guess there are no Jews in that movie.
Arturo, 
Please tell me where the line actually is so I can cross it.
You and the rest of the lying cheating half-wits who support the doofus in the White House should really try to ensure that Obamacare stays in place to cover your mental health bills.
Is that over the line? Do I have to try again?
Edited to add bold so it has more venom. GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
ajc said:
sbenois said:
Except of course when you and the rest of the MORONS on the right want to dictate to a woman what she should be doing with her womb. You are such a ******* hypocrite Arturo.
Sbenois, It's all about "Individual freedom", and IMHO, with certain exceptions, that does not include the slaughter of the unborn capable of living outside the womb. (I'll be happy to debate you on the issues)
As I said, I see it more like it's the weaker among us, (the left) who are typically the ones who have less interest in freedom from government; and sometimes for better or worse, prefer to have government control us, whether others need it or not...
BTW pal, you and your ilk are getting ever and ever closer to crossing the line with your increasingly fowl and insulting personal remarks. If you guys can't control yourselves, and keep the comments to the issues, then maybe the next time we meet, instead of shaking hands, you may find mine up the side of your head...
Hey Art-your quote above is a criminal threat. If someone wanted to press charges they have your words here in print.
https://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/crime-penalties/federal/Criminal-Threats.htm
Wait, wait, Arturo, here is a "fowl" remark about you and the rest of your "ilk"...you remind me of Foghorn Leghorn. Right to the very end...
ajc said:
I don't blindly go down any road Ridski... I'm my own person; and I don't fit perfectly in any box, right or left. The problem here is it's too easy to categorize one person with "everything", that one side or another says, or does. I'm as guilty as the next guy, so let's all try to agree not to agree, and stop always making it so personal, with all the childish name calling. Just say'n...
If you think Donald Trump has any interest in your personal freedom, then you are delusional. There are so many things to despise about the man, but publicly expressed admiration of autocrats and dictators should--lets say--give you pause.
Hey ajc,
What do you think about arming Boy Scouts? It could be a merit badge. They're not unionized and are already a paramilitary organization with a decent track record of service.
Sponsored Business
Promote your business here - Businesses get highlighted throughout the site and you can add a deal.
For Sale
-
2007 Honda Fit $4,400
More info
During the hysterical phase of the "stop the memo" campaign, Adam Schiff said that Nunes had sent the White House an"altered" version of the memo to the White House. The Republicans replied that the changes were (1) grammatical (2) a change requested by the Dems (3) a change requested by the FBI to protect sources and methods.
To my knowledge, the reply has not been challenged.
The DOJ / FBI attempt to block the release of the Republican memo by the White House did not identify sources and methods. That issue had apparently been vetted before the memo was sent to the WH.