Waco melee... 9 people dead... but don't you dare call it a riot!

So 9 people killed, some by the cops. Fighting, damage... a melee... Love that word. It makes a riot or a brawl so much more upscale!

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/19/us/waco-texas-biker-gang-shooting.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur&bicmp=AD&bicmlukp=WT.mc_id&bicmst=1409232722000&bicmet=1419773522000

Well, it wasn't a riot.  Crazier than a riot in a lot of ways.  A contemporary shootout at the OK Corral.

Certainly was a riot:

"a violent disturbance of the peace by a crowd."

A huge crowd of bikers took over the area including the restaurant and proceeded to have a shoot out inside the restaurant.  How is that not a riot?  The disparity between the coverage of this and the riots in Ferguson and Baltimore is very telling.

Why is the question of whether or not it was a riot the main point of this thread? I skimmed the article and didn't manage to spot anything about riot/not riot. What did I miss???

It was not a riot. It was a battle. Rival groups fighting against each other.

If the bikers were all black, how do you think this story would be covered by the media?  If you think it would be the same, then you are mistaken.

8 people were murdered in the middle of a public restaurant and you call it a "battle."  Seriously?

It was rival gangs. Fighting it out. I think if the gang members were African American that aspect would have been even more played up.

I call it a gunfight.  Whether anyone wants to call it a riot (or not) is up to them, but it surely doesn't change or mean anything either way. 

"No bystanders or officers were wounded in the violence in which bikers were armed with guns, knives and clubs. "

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-waco-biker-gang-deaths-20150518-story.html

This was a battle fought by specific groups. Pure and simple.

Actually the best word for this type of gang fight might be the classic one (though this one was on a grand scale): A Rumble.

yahooyahoo said:

Certainly was a riot:

"a violent disturbance of the peace by a crowd."

A huge crowd of bikers took over the area including the restaurant and proceeded to have a shoot out inside the restaurant.  How is that not a riot?  The disparity between the coverage of this and the riots in Ferguson and Baltimore is very telling.

 I associate the term riot with a lot of non-targeted property damage.

If the gangs were black and 9 people were killed, it would have been reported and quickly forgotten. For instance the tag line would be "9 Gang Members Killed in Weekend Violence." Add white people to the mix and you get a different journalistic approach.

Got to ask an obvious question-

what bar owner in his right mind invites motorcycle gangs to drink at his bar?

Like bullet holes in cars?

"Investigators spent the night collecting evidence. Hundreds of cars and motorcycles are still in the parking lot, many of them covered in bullet holes. All bodies have been recovered from the crime scene."

tjohn said:

yahooyahoo said:

Certainly was a riot:

"a violent disturbance of the peace by a crowd."

A huge crowd of bikers took over the area including the restaurant and proceeded to have a shoot out inside the restaurant.  How is that not a riot?  The disparity between the coverage of this and the riots in Ferguson and Baltimore is very telling.

 I associate the term riot with a lot of non-targeted property damage.

Actually it was a three way gunfight as the cops were shooting as well.  I suspect the story will get more interesting when it turns out that the police may well have done the most damage.  No cops were shot, which kind of indicates that the bikers weren't very good with their firearms. 

The cops were already in the area to prevent any conflict.  That clearly failed.

bobk said:

Actually it was a three way gunfight as the cops were shooting as well.  I suspect the story will get more interesting when it turns out that the police may well have done the most damage.  No cops were shot, which kind of indicates that the bikers weren't very good with their firearms. 

All we need now is Leonard Bernstein to set this "rumble" to music.

wharfrat said:

Got to ask an obvious question-

what bar owner in his right mind invites motorcycle gangs to drink at his bar?

Maybe he was cowed like the bar owner in "The Wild One."

yahooyahoo said:

The cops were already in the area to prevent any conflict.  That clearly failed.

bobk said:

Actually it was a three way gunfight as the cops were shooting as well.  I suspect the story will get more interesting when it turns out that the police may well have done the most damage.  No cops were shot, which kind of indicates that the bikers weren't very good with their firearms. 

 

 I thought it was odd how the police were patting themselves on the back for a job well done.

They consider it a job well done because the bikers only killed each other and no innocent bystanders. 

The point of their presence obviously was peace. It was containment.

I think white people need to explicitly distance themselves from this kind of behavior and condemn it in the harshest terms.

At least 4 bikers were killed by the police.

I get why the OP posted as he/she did. If this gang were any other color, this would have been round the clock news coverage of the "rioting thugs who have held Waco hostage" (my ad-lib). But because they are not of another hue, this hasn't received the attention it deserves. This is lawlessness at it's worse. Nine dead is a bit light to me, considering that many shot at police with VISIBLE guns. See where the OP's going?

ml1 said:

I think white people need to explicitly distance themselves from this kind of behavior and condemn it in the harshest terms.

 It's white culture, and the breakdown of the white family structure.

It was like a Palin family brawl, but with guns.

American Heritage Dictionary:

"Melee 1.a. Confused, hand-to-hand fighting in a pitched battle.  b. A violent free-for-all"

"Battle 1.a.  A large-scale combat between two armed forces.   b.  Armed fighting; combat."

Sounds pretty much like what happened.  Both allude to fighting between sides.  Riot doesn't have to involve opposed groups.

nohero said:

ml1 said:

I think white people need to explicitly distance themselves from this kind of behavior and condemn it in the harshest terms.

 It's white culture, and the breakdown of the white family structure.

It was like a Palin family brawl, but with guns.

 it's that damn music that white people listen to.  everybody's got a truck, and everybody's got a gun.  

ml1 said:

I think white people need to explicitly distance themselves from this kind of behavior and condemn it in the harshest terms.

 Absolutely agree, except for the "white" part, as these gang members are a danger to anyone regardless of race.  These are criminals, romantic notions of organized crime as portrayed by Hollywood does a disservice when people start to believe the fairy tale.  These criminals also do fund raising for charities to gain sympathy from the local community so they will forget the vile crimes these scumbags are guilty of.  I'm glad to read that no officers or innocent bystanders were injured or killed.

I thought riots were predominantly a form of civil unrest, with the police pitted against a group of people bound by a common cause of some sort.

spontaneous said:

ml1 said:

I think white people need to explicitly distance themselves from this kind of behavior and condemn it in the harshest terms.

 Absolutely agree, except for the "white" part, as these gang members are a danger to anyone regardless of race.  These are criminals, romantic notions of organized crime as portrayed by Hollywood does a disservice when people start to believe the fairy tale.  These criminals also do fund raising for charities to gain sympathy from the local community so they will forget the vile crimes these scumbags are guilty of.  I'm glad to read that no officers or innocent bystanders were injured or killed.

 I think Jamie needs to give us an *irony* emoticon.

ml1 said:

spontaneous said:

ml1 said:

I think white people need to explicitly distance themselves from this kind of behavior and condemn it in the harshest terms.

 Absolutely agree, except for the "white" part, as these gang members are a danger to anyone regardless of race.  These are criminals, romantic notions of organized crime as portrayed by Hollywood does a disservice when people start to believe the fairy tale.  These criminals also do fund raising for charities to gain sympathy from the local community so they will forget the vile crimes these scumbags are guilty of.  I'm glad to read that no officers or innocent bystanders were injured or killed.

 I think Jamie needs to give us an *irony* emoticon.

 If you are referring to your original post I'd say it was more along the lines of sarcasm than irony.  I just chose to answer it at face value.

Totes *sarcasm* . (Don't believe Alanis Morrisette... ) But I got it right away. 

However, when we assign race to any particular behavior, it fuels the idea that having racial stereotypes is okay. One of my pet peeves is "white trash." Would you say "black trash" without adding "bag" to the end? Oh, but the list goes on and on...