Do You Demand That Another Car Be Opened If ...

... the NJT conductors assure you and several others standing in the crowded last open car, waiting to leave Penn Station, that there are plenty of empty seats at the front of the train?

Assume:

(a) you're "a regular customer"

(b) your requests for a reason why the next car isn't opened go unanswered

(c) you're vocal, this is a cause bigger than you alone, and, after all, you've just gotten off a platform

Opinion on the 9:51 tonight was divided.

#RESIST!

Most likely reason is that there are not enough crew to cover opening additional cars. It is also possible that the car you want to see open is defective for some reason, such as lack of heat/air depending on season. Sad truth is that demand for train ridership to/from NYP is greater than the number of seats available.

Before I ask the next question, I need to know: do you have legs?

(d) legs (one pair, functional)

Could be true, but could be just plain ol' laziness on the part of the conductors.

joan_crystal said:

Most likely reason is that there are not enough crew to cover opening additional cars. It is also possible that the car you want to see open is defective for some reason, such as lack of heat/air depending on season. Sad truth is that demand for train ridership to/from NYP is greater than the number of seats available.

What fascinated me, beyond the unusually loud and extended broadside against inconvenience, was the way some nearby passengers murmered their assent while others shouted from the middle of the car for the fellow to knock it off. After it was over, a guy across from me shrugged and said with a smile that the conductors were just doing their job; the man sitting behind him interrupted his immersion in his phone as the conductor collected his ticket to tell him, with a note of pique, that Mr. Advocate had been absolutely right.

The fascinating part to me is why y'all didn't move to the front where the seats were.

Because I'm a customer, and there's an empty car right there, and New Jersey Transit is always treating its customers this way, and why can't you just open that car?

A woman I take the train with has complained about there being closed cars on some trains, and was assured by customer service--more than once--that all cars are open on all trains...

Well, customer service in that instance is just plain loopy.

Move to the front of the train. NJT loses enough money without having to staff unnecessary cars because people are too lazy or entitled to walk to the front of the train when there are open seats.

Max, was that you catcalling from the middle of the car?

Nope. I only exist on the internet.

I never believe them when they say there are empty seats in the front (or back) of the train. On numerous occasions I've been sitting / standing in whatever end of the train they say has ample room when hearing this announcement, and it seems to be a complete lie. I'm sure that's not always the case, but I tend not to trust NJT.

PurpleMonkeyDshwashr said:

I never believe them when they say there are empty seats in the front (or back) of the train. On numerous occasions I've been sitting / standing in whatever end of the train they say has ample room when hearing this announcement, and it seems to be a complete lie. I'm sure that's not always the case, but I tend not to trust NJT.

You are wise.

The biggest transit lie is on the subway: "there's another train directly behind this one."

I should probably admit something: I'm the naive midday/weekend commuter type who wonders why a conductor opens another car just because -- or so it appears -- riders are starting to have to sit two abreast.

Aren't we ignoring the safety issue if there are empty cars while riders stand packed in other cars on the same train.....

yahooyahoo said:

Aren't we ignoring the safety issue if there are empty cars while riders stand packed in other cars on the same train.....

The Pollyanna OP's question presumes that the conductors weren't lying when they said there was room in the open front cars.

Back in the days when I was commuting, this happened to me on many occasions. To those who ask "do you have 2 legs" my response is yes, but I have a physical disability and can't stand for extended periods of time. No one would ever get out of the handicapped seats for me. When I complained to NJT Customer Service they said the conductors are obligated to open closed-off cars when there is standing room only or if someone like me needs a seat. I asked them, fine, then who do I complain to on the train when they refuse? I heard nothing but crickets.

I'll repeat -- thank goodness I don't have to ride the trains or buses any more!!

Smedley said:

The biggest transit lie is on the subway: "there's another train directly behind this one."

Well, unless there's something other than a train behind it, they're correct.

Walking all the way to the front car from near the back (or vice versa) is not so trivial (even for the able-bodied) in the double decker trains where you have to take stairs at each end of each car, especially once the train is moving.

(e) the train is still a few minutes away from departure

when this happens I usually just walk to the front.

max_weisenfeld said:

Move to the front of the train. NJT loses enough money without having to staff unnecessary cars because people are too lazy or entitled to walk to the front of the train when there are open seats.

I've experienced this many times and it drives me nuts.

Question: This often happens on later trains....Does NJT, in fact, provide less staff on these trains?

If the answer is "No," then the NJT train staff is making their life easier at the expense of a customer base that has to put up with a lot of inconveniences (admittedly some beyond NJT's control, but nevertheless NJT is no doubt aware of the frequent late trains, occasional canceled trains, overcrowding, etc.).

At the end of the long day in the City to be asked to walk the length of the train simply to make it an easier shift for the NJT staff is not acceptable (particularly since many suspect they'll get to the other end and find no seat anyway).

I can't claim to know a lot about NJT procedures; but...

I presume that there's a Conductor on every train and that there are a number of Assistant Conductors on each train, based upon the number of cars a given train is scheduled to transport passengers.

While an engine may pull more cars than are scheduled for passenger use (NJT does have to move train cars about) I'm thinking that opening a car without the proper staffing might just create problems in the event of an emergency.

While most of us might think the Conductor and Assistant Conductors as no more than ticket takers; I'd like to think that they've had some training in dealing with emergency situations. Kinda like flight attendants on airliners.

So, if a train is staffed for six passenger cars; do you really want the three persons assigned to help us, deal with another two, or four, cars with passengers?

Then again, I don't know a lot about NJT staffing procedures.

Just thinking out loud here in Maplewood.

TomR

my assumption is that the bars that are used to close off a car would have been removed by NJT if closing a car was against policy.

ml1 said:

my assumption is that the bars that are used to close off a car would have been removed by NJT if closing a car was against policy.

Seriously?? How blind an assumption can you make?

Tom_R said:

Then again, I don't know a lot about NJT staffing procedures.

Me, either, but that's my presumption, too: that whether it's a matter of safety and/or other reasons negotiated between NJT and the conductors' union, there is a maximum number of cars that can be open depending on the size of the crew.