Board of Trustees Special Meeting to Discuss Village Hall - June 15

All,

A meeting is being scheduled for Monday (June 15) to share the details of the bids we received regarding Village Hall. At this time, you will be able to provide feedback. So save the date, I will share more information as it becomes available. The meeting will begin at 8pm (location TBD).

Thanx for the post!!!

First, I have not looked, but I will ask anyway. Are the bids posted someplace where I can pre-read them?

Later,

The George

They will be available next week along with cost projections for the different scenarios. We have a final meeting this week with one of the bidders and the purchase price/parking is still being discussed so we're not sharing those numbers yet.

As a reminder, the following is a rough accounting of the project cost of the Village Hall Renovation project as of right now (This does not yet include costs to extend the rent for temporary offices, or the construction manager's contract). "Sunk Costs" are highlighted in blue.

If the BOT elects to sell the building, the only money "wasted" would be the Construction Manager and the Architect's Fee (unless those services were utilized in whole or part in connection with the demolition/asbestos removal) as the asbestos had to be resolved prior to disposition of the property and the relocation/improvement costs would have been needed in any event if the building is sold.

Here's a flyer.

.

I would like to attend, and pending any requirements of the spouse I will be at the meeting.

My time will be short. Will this be the only item? Or, First on a longer agenda, or last?

I will be looking for the link to any Further Information. It is hard to give feedback with out knowledge, other than what one hears at a meeting.

The info that I have now is street rumor based.

Later, Da

George

George - Sheena announced at Monday's BOT meeting that the two proposals being considered are for a restaurant or a boutique hotel. There were other proposals that were not considered to merit consideration. Further discussions are being held with the parties and the numbers couldn't be released to the public yet. The numbers will be given at the community meeting on June 15, which is being held solely to discuss the proposals. As I recall, a decision has to be made by June 23, and a BOT special meeting will have to called in order to meet the deadline.

I'm sure that Sheena will correct any of the above if it's not right.

Sheena so happy this is happening. Unfortunately its about 2 years late given costs incurred by the Village and wasted time. I have been proponent of anything but admin offices for years. (can check the archives)

The Village will make lemonade out the lemon we have, which is great. Hopefully other projects will get a full review prior to action.

Next up should be suing the Village Atty for malpractice relating the the rescue squad deal. More to come on this..

Restaurant which will use the Cryan's Liquor License.

BOT likely to ask State ABC to waive underage drinking fines levied against license.

This could get very interesting. The decision isn't just whether the restaurant proposal or hotel proposal would be better for South Orange and the downtown, but whether we should sell it in the first place or renovate it ourselves... And it's all happening with a very immediate timeline.

This is likely going to be one of the most important decisions our Village has to make this decade and will impact us for years to come. From the information I have at present, I certainly have a strong opinion as to the right course of action for South Orange to take, but I'm eager to learn more.

The first BOT vote taken to even CONSIDER selling the building didn't pass, though the second one did. I'm curious as to where the trustees stand on this now and how the vote is likely to go.If you agree about the significance of this decision, you should probably try to make it to Monday's meeting and the BOT meeting that this is brought to vote on this month. The book is going to close on this soon and it could end up being a close vote.

I expect to hear a lot of emotional arguments about how important it is to keep everything exactly the same and that we "should not destroy our downtown" etc.

Personally, I'm generally in favor of preserving old structure (to wit: we are doing our darnest to maintain and bring back our 101 year old house, so I'd like to think I put my money where my mouth is). Having said that, I'd rather see village hall be sold and preserved and used as a thriving downtown destination (whether it's a hotel, or restaurant), than to see it preserved and just serve as expensive municipal office space..

While I would love to see a good restaurant there, or a hotel--both of which, in particular the hotel, would make the area more lively--one thing to consider is what would happen if the hotel or restaurant wasn't successful, and went under? Then, we would back to where we are now, a lovely empty space in the center of downtown.

Perhaps this is a good time to use our $5000 survey tool for something other than what browser people use?

Thats why the town should SELL it. If a business fails then the lender if any owns it. Also Its not lovely right now it is decrepit. Lender will then sell property to new owner and new business. At least it will be fixed up with no cost to the Village.

relx said:
While I would love to see a good restaurant there, or a hotel--both of which, in particular the hotel, would make the area more lively--one thing to consider is what would happen if the hotel or restaurant wasn't successful, and went under? Then, we would back to where we are now, a lovely empty space in the center of downtown.

New process seems like a breath of fresh air, since Torpey never bothered to ask the Board to vote on approving the entirety of the Village Hall renovation.

Much like SOPAC's construction, public monies spent on VH have been approved piecemeal, one contract at a time.

Yes, I know some bonding was authorized, but that does not equate to approving a $6-$7M capital expenditure.

SOguy said:
Next up should be suing the Village Atty for malpractice relating the the rescue squad deal. More to come on this..

I think that it should actually be the redevelopment attorney, not the Village Attorney (though, I'm sure he's failed the BOT/Village on any number of occasions).

Yes.. thanks for pointing that out.. the guy who said yeah about $1mm should be enough

Steve said:

SOguy said:
Next up should be suing the Village Atty for malpractice relating the the rescue squad deal. More to come on this..

I think that it should actually be the redevelopment attorney, not the Village Attorney (though, I'm sure he's failed the BOT/Village on any number of occasions).

Unfortunately, and it's been said before that he should be sued for malpractice, it'll never happen.

Do I think selling Village Hall is ideal? No. But it's the only responsible decision we can make if there's a high quality, solid proposal for purchasing the building.

It comes down to this: You can only have what you can afford. We're looking at what is likely to be at least a seven million dollar debt service with this project AND what would have to be an aggressive maintenance plan down the road to keep this building in shape over time. Having a building of this size, economic scale and environmental footprint is not necessary for Village Hall services in the times we live and will likely become even less necessary in the future. Not only will it not be marketable to sell once we do our renovation, we would take a wash on it if we did.

To make matters worse, we have other buildings that need massive repairs or gut renovations: the Baird, the Police Station, the Library, the Connett Building and DPW headquarters (the Skate House too, though that's a smaller footprint). During a time when we have tens of millions of dollars of building infrastructure needs and already boast some of the highest taxes in the country, renovating this building is simply a luxury that is beyond our means.

If we can put the Village Hall property on the tax rolls and collect the purchase price, save the renovation money, connect the disjointed east and west sections of the downtown, put in a destination anchor business AND make absolute certain the historic facade is and remains protected, then this is a win/win for South Orange and certainly makes the most out an unfortunate situation.

I would love to see Fishy run for BOT. A lot of people would.

I'm just happy he posts here.

FilmCarp said:
I'm just happy he posts here.

+1

In the past, Fishy has stated his reasons for not running for BOT and I respect him for that.

Its nuts for the village to take on the capital expense of this building.

Continue renting space and enjoy the flexibility of being able to adjust space over time and not be stuck with a building that is either under utilized or cramped.

Great that this is happening!

Fishy makes a lot of sense. I would have been tremendously disappointed if the building had been torn down. It's one of the things that attracted me to South Orange. But I really don't care what's in there -- village or private. If someone wants to buy it, fix it up, and operate a business in there, terrific!

cramer said:
I would love to see Fishy run for BOT. A lot of people would.

Fishy and Sheena would make a formidable pair, yes. Though given his record of contributions to SO and his fervent belief in the town, SO sure isn't losing much by him remaining on the outside looking in either. (And yes, I know you know that too--

Personally, I'd like to see HIM be the one to open the restaurant in VH (ahem). KALM frontage on the SO Ave side (buy what we cooked your dinner with/in!) and a restaurant/cafe around the corner. And no dedicated parking space needed! Wins all around!

(Seriously though--what he said above makes a great deal of sense.)

Fishy pointed out the elephant in the room, which I have noted before as well. All of the buildings the Village owns require extensive renovations. I've seen proposed and estimated numbers on some of them, including Police HQ and the Baird. Add the Connett Building, and the Library, plus Village Hall, and we are conservatively talking about $30 Million. It's likely to be higher, when you consider change orders and scope creep.

I am not saying that the cost automatically precludes these projects. What I am saying is that we do not have a master plan for municipal space. Before we commit to any of these projects, we should at least know:

• How much space, and in what configurations, the Village requires.
• What is the ideal municipal or non-municipal use for each of the properties we have?
• What is the market value of each property?
• Are there other alternatives for municipal offices and functions that are outside of the currently owned properties (such as the current use of SOPAC for meetings and 76 SOA for office space) What would the costs be to make these or similar arrangements more permanent?
• What are the costs to the Village for the various alternatives?

Village Hall is the most urgent, and also, to me, the most obvious. It is already gutted and construction ready. It already has viable bidders. It is in a physical location that is surrounded on both sides by a retail corridor. Finishing the renovation ourselves is likely to cost $6 Million additional, and when we are done, it's mostly just office space, that the majority of the citizens will never see. I would support its sale for one of the proposed uses.

After that, we need a comprehensive study of owned properties, required space, proposed usage, etc., that answers the questions above, provides options, and makes recommendations. The idea that we should simply renovate them all in sequence, without a master plan, is one that we simply cannot afford.

So my haunted house proposal didn't make the final cut? Boo.

;-)

Are there any restrictions on the use of the Connett building? It's a handsome building in a great location. It seems like something interesting could be done with it.